Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Manny Cid

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect‎ to 2024 Miami-Dade County mayoral election#Candidates as a viable ATD. Should he win, history remains for this to be spun back out Star Mississippi 03:09, 21 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Manny Cid[edit]

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Manny Cid (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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Non-notable mayor of a small city in Florida (population 30,000). Manny Cid doesn't seem to have gotten in-depth news coverage from any outlets outside the Miami area, there's just some routine coverage of his administration and campaigns from local outlets. I don't see any reason to justify him having a Wikipedia page. It's also worth pointing out that this page was created shortly after Cid announced his candidacy for Miami-Dade County mayor, and that the creator has only ever edited this page, the page for the city where Cid serves as mayor, and the page for the election he's currently running in. Also, a different editor had to come in and remove "peacock terms and unsourced, OR, self-sourced text." BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 04:35, 13 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete, the secondary sources are WP:ROTM for any local politician, Overall not enough to establish WP:NOTABILITY or significant coverage per WP:POLITICIAN, which notes that candidacy doesn't confer any notability either. Shaws username . talk . 12:11, 13 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Local newspaper coverage does not count towards notability, and he is already mentioned in the infobox and government section of Miami Lakes, Florida. I do not believe that a further merge would be suitable for that article. AllTheUsernamesAreInUse (talk) 21:57, 14 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I do not see any guideline that local coverage cannot be used to establish notability. I am paraphrasing a fella named Bearcat who pertinently wrote on another AFD: "Notability of a mayor does not rest on the population of the city or local news coverage rather it rests on the ability to write and source a substantive article about the mayor's political impact. If that can be done, then a mayor can keep an article even if the place they were mayor of was a no-horse village and if it can't be done then a mayor gets deleted." There seems to be enough to write a substantive article here given 15 pages of news articles as well as multiple entries in newspapers.com.Patapsco913 (talk) 02:32, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
From my understanding, it's not that local coverage can't establish any notability, just that it's harder. A local paper is expected to write about the local mayor, their plans for the area, what their future political plans are, and so on. Whereas national media (or local from an entirely different area) isn't expected to cover them, as well as their reputability (or not) being fairly well known, and so can be used to quickly establish notability. That said, a lot of the coverage about mayors and electoral candidates is fairly run of the mill and having articles about every single one would become excessive. WP:NPOL gives "multiple news feature articles" as the bar for local figures to meet, so from my understanding the question is if there are multiple feature articles about him from reliable independant sources, excluding those he would have gained from simply being a mayor or candidate. All my results are the generic mayor/candiate stories but that might just be my search so I'm happy to be corrected on that. Shaws username . talk . 03:55, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
My mistake assuming that local coverage couldn't be used to establish notability, but I do agree more with Shaws here. Any mayor or local politician is bound to have plenty of local coverage, so we must be able to find a sufficient amount of sources that aren't WP:ROTM. AllTheUsernamesAreInUse (talk) 04:30, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Local coverage isn't necessarily inadmissible, but it also isn't necessarily enough if it's all that a person has. The thing is that every mayor of everywhere will always have some evidence of coverage in the local media of the town or city where he's mayor, because covering local politics is literally local media's primary reason for being — so if all you needed to do to make a mayor notable enough for a Wikipedia article was show a few hits of local coverage, then every mayor of everywhere would always be notable enough and there would be no grounds to distinguish a notable mayor from a non-notable mayor at all anymore. So the actual rule is that to be notable enough for Wikipedia, a local politician (mayor, city councillor, etc.) has to demonstrate a credible reason why he or she should be treated as a special case of significantly greater notability than the norm — such as their coverage geographically expanding far beyond the purely local, and/or substantive evidence that their leadership had an important and enduring impact on the city — and the article cannot just be "he got elected and then got re-elected again, the end". Bearcat (talk) 18:05, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Cid was the first mayor in the United States to allow for remote public comments for residents. Here are several national outlets that wrote on this. https://www.governing.com/archive/gov-miami-lakes-town-council-video-conferencing.html https://commonedge.org/conducting-city-government-on-zoom-mayor-manny-cid/. He has also been mentioned on several national outlets including here: https://www.politico.com/newsletters/florida-playbook/2023/09/06/miami-dade-contest-heats-up-00114184. Many cities followed his lead and implemented remote participation. His impact extends far beyond where he is mayor. MEAUSA (talk) 20:16, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And what's significant about being the first mayor in the United States to allow for "remote public comments for residents"? Why is that important? Why is that a thing that people will still be looking for information about in the 2030s? In 2024, of all times, you're trying to claim that using Zoom makes somebody special in and of itself? Bearcat (talk) 21:01, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete, without prejudice against recreation in the future if somebody can do better. As always, mayors aren't all "inherently" notable just because they exist, and have to show evidence that they can be considered a special case of significantly greater notability than the norm for the role — but this is just "personal background and election record", which isn't enough in and of itself. The key to writing a good, keepable article about a mayor is to focus on his actual record in office: specific things he did as mayor, specific projects he spearheaded as mayor, specific effects that his mayoralty had on the development of the city, and other evidence of his political impact, not just his personal life and election record. Bearcat (talk) 18:13, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
People do not get Wikipedia articles just for standing as candidates in elections they haven't already won, either. Candidates get Wikipedia articles only if they already cleared the notability bar for other reasons anyway. (For example, Hillary Clinton may not have won the presidency, but she previously held other notable offices besides the presidency, and was notable on those grounds regardless of her success or failure in the presidential election.) Bearcat (talk) 21:12, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Getting "mentioned" in a major outlet does not establish notability. That mention in the Politico article is a perfect example of WP:ROTM campaign coverage. Also, those "national outlets" don't exactly seem prominent enough to establish notability. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 23:24, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Unfortunately, due to the timing, this seems to be political in nature. The day after this article comes out (https://www.politicalcortadito.com/2024/02/12/levine-cava-camp-responds-manny-cid-video/) this Wikipedia page come under attack? Might be a coincidence but the timing just brings up questions. MEAUSA (talk) 22:35, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • This is not political in nature. Trust me, I have nothing against Manny Cid and I didn't even know who he was before this, and I would bet that all other editors in this discussion would say the same. You can bring up the timing but don't baselessly accuse us of making political attacks. See WP:ASPERSIONS. Funny you bring up politics anyway, as I have several questions I could ask you. AllTheUsernamesAreInUse (talk) 23:16, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
lmfao this is killing me. You really cracked the code here! What is even supposed to be the theory? Oh man, I happened to start this discussion right after Levine Cava criticized her rival! It's totally not like opponents in an election criticize each other very frequently! Could it be that a minor blog happened to publish an article about Levine Cava right before I started this discussion? No, it can't be a coincidence! BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 23:37, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect >>2024 Miami-Dade County mayoral election. Djflem (talk) 18:37, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Xxanthippe: Assuming people have this page in their watchlists, what do we think of this as a possible WP:ATD? AllTheUsernamesAreInUse (talk) 21:37, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I like it, it's a good option for people searching for him, I've struck my delete above for it. Shaws username . talk . 21:46, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sure, I'd support a redirect. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 23:24, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This BLP exists only for the purpose of promotion and contains negligible content. It should be deleted. Xxanthippe (talk) 23:54, 15 February 2024 (UTC).[reply]
@Xxanthippe: What if we deleted it and then turned it into a redirect? AllTheUsernamesAreInUse (talk) 03:12, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
See my comment above. Xxanthippe (talk) 23:35, 16 February 2024 (UTC).[reply]
@Xxanthippe: I might be a little stupid but would you mind delineating a bit further? Do you fear that the redirect will be turned back into a promotional BLP? I would think that a redirect would be beneficial to the reader. AllTheUsernamesAreInUse (talk) 23:41, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
WP:BLUDGEON. Xxanthippe (talk) 02:45, 19 February 2024 (UTC).[reply]
What's your problem? They were just asking. And for the record, they're right, your comment did not explain why a redirect would not be useful. Having a redirect is not promotional, it's just convenient for anyone searching. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 03:17, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I apologize if my pinging came off as a bit annoying, but bludgeoning? Yeah I'm gonna have to agree with ChocolateMilk here. AllTheUsernamesAreInUse (talk) 03:41, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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